Re: [AUDITORY] [widmann@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx: Re: [AUDITORY] Origin of the 'Bregman picture'?]

Subject: Re: [AUDITORY] [widmann@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx: Re: [AUDITORY] Origin of the 'Bregman picture'?]

From: Pierre Divenyi <pdivenyi@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2019 22:02:11 -0800

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Comments: To: "R. Zatorre, Dr." <robert.zatorre@xxxxxxxxx>

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Reply-to: Pierre Divenyi <pdivenyi@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

Sender: AUDITORY - Research in Auditory Perception <AUDITORY@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

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A wonderful analogy, indeed! I must have heard it from Al but, given more my age than my social status, I forgot it. Thank you Robert for the thorough description.

Best,
Pierre

On 2/22/19 5:29 PM, R. Zatorre, Dr. wrote:

Dear Peter (and list) Although I actually never saw this drawing before, I heard Al talk about the idea many times (I don't recall ever seeing him use the sketch either, it was just a verbal description). His idea was simple but clever: The observer on the beach is supposed to look at the movement of the things floating in the water of the two channels carved into the sand, and from that alone, deduce the objects that are in the ocean, their distance, motion, direction, and so forth. "You are no doubt thinking 'Why that's impossible!' " Al would say, and the audience would nod their agreement; then he would go on to point out that this is the computational problem the auditory system has to solve all the time: the movement up and down of the water in the channels represents the changes in air pressure arriving at the two ears; from this alone, the auditory system must figure out the presence of sources out in the environment along with their motion etc, while of course ignoring background noise (the analogue of which would be wind causing ripples in the ocean).

It's a fun adjunct for an undergrad class on perception I think.

best wishes

Robert

Robert Zatorre
Montreal Neurological Institute
McGill University
514-398-8903
fax: 514-398-1338
www.zlab.mcgill.ca

From: AUDITORY - Research in Auditory Perception <AUDITORY@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf of Peter P. <peterparker@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: February 21, 2019 8:32 AM
To: AUDITORY@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [widmann@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx: Re: [AUDITORY] Origin of the 'Bregman picture'?]

Forgive me, but what is this picture about? I am curious but don't have
Goldstein's book at hand.

Thanks!
Peter

----- Forwarded message from Andreas Widmann <widmann@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> -----

From: Andreas Widmann <widmann@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: Andreas Widmann <widmann@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: AUDITORY@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [AUDITORY] Origin of the 'Bregman picture'?
Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2019 11:57:25 +0100
Sender: AUDITORY - Research in Auditory Perception <AUDITORY@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

> was also pointed to Goldstein’s ‘Sensation and perception’ where I couldn't find it neither.
It appears in the German version of Goldstein, 4th edition, 1997, Spektrum. Page 352, Figure 9.1. There are no image credits for the figure.

Best,
Andreas

> Am 19.02.2019 um 12:35 schrieb Brinkmann, Fabian <fabian.brinkmann@xxxxxxxxxxxx>:
>
> Dear List,
>
> does anyone know the origin of the attached picture? It is usually referenced to Albert Bregman’s work on auditory scene analysis, however, I fail to find it in his book. I was also pointed to Goldstein’s ‘Sensation and perception’ where I couldn't find it neither.
>
> Best
> Fabian
>
> <Bregman_ASA.jpg>

----- End forwarded message -----