Subject: Re: [AUDITORY] Note durations in music ][ From: Kevin Austin <kevin.austin@xxxxxxxx> Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2013 14:12:57 -0400 List-Archive:<http://lists.mcgill.ca/scripts/wa.exe?LIST=AUDITORY>I still remain confounded partly by the question, as I perceive it as = being incomplete. I do not hear music / melody as being 'notes in a line', and cannot = abstract melody as a sequence of durations of notes in a piece. I hear = this as being at a sub-vocabulary level. In written language, something = similar to working out the frequency and order of circles, three-quarter = circles and semicircles, to quarter-circles in letters in a printed = text. The letters o, pdbqg, c, e, s, m, n, r, j etc, using this shape in = progressively incomplete form. The tune Happy Birthday, played staccato or legato, will have the same = identity. As an instrumental performer, I played this as long-short = long, but in singing with untrained people, the rhythm is short-short = long. In the short-short-long version, the rhythmic isomorphic nature to = the Star Spangled Banner is lost. [I have a conflated version of Happy = Birthday for anyone interested.]. I am not an ethnomusicologist. In the example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DD2ntQK9F4bw Malladi brothers - Guru Poornima - 2 July 2012 starting around 5:25 in order to meet the criteria of the request, for = me, the duration of the 'notes' [sic] is entirely hierarchical. At this = point in the piece, the very short notes of the performers are = ornamental to the principal note. Observe the audience at around 7'10, and the singers throughout placing = the 'rhythm' within the broader underlying cycle. I seem to understand [after about 9'15], that the shorter notes are = structural at the end of the song. Starting in the second song, c 10'00, = there appear to be multiple interpretations of the structure of the = underlying cycle [watch the performers and audience members' hands]. I think these [kritis] are both by one of the most famous Carnatic = composers Thyagaraja. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kriti http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thyagaraja It is noted by western music theorists that there is no large body of = theoretical writing on the subject of "rhythm" [sic] in western music. = Even the touchstone of intelligent research, Wikipedia, does not seem to = be able to unshackle itself: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhythm conflating rhythm with pulse, beat and meter. The ancient Cooper & = Meyer, "The Rhythmic Structure of Music", University of Chicago, 1960, = ISBN 0-226-11522-4, seems from another century. Kevin On 2013, Jun 16, at 1:00 AM, Kevin Austin <kevin.austin@xxxxxxxx> = wrote: > Having pondered the question and the responses for a few days, I still = am not clear on the core issue. For me this is partly tied up with the = lack of definitions of the term "note". In my classes I try to avoid the = word without specific context to delimit the meaning. >=20 > There are two [or more] possible interpretations here: > [1] onset time to onset time > [2] duration of the sounding element > [2a] adding the duration of any non-sounding element[s] -- rests = or silences >=20 > There is not a great deal of solo monophonic music in the classical = western music repertoire compared with the quantity of music that has = more than one pitch sounding at one time. >=20 > Within the solo monophonic repertoire, composed music which is beyond = being a very simple tune, eg God Save the Queen played on a flute, is = very often working to create the illusion of more than one pitch at a = time. To see this in a very simple / complex example, take the Bach = Prelude in C Major from book One of the Well-Tempered Clavier. It can be = played with one finger. It can also be heard as a five-voice homophonic = composition. >=20 > Since the well-known repertoire is so small, it is likely a matter of = going to some much more relatively obscure sources, such as Johann = Quantz > = http://imslp.org/wiki/Fantasies_and_Preludes_for_Flute_(Quantz,_Johann_Joa= chim) > or other solo =E9tudes. Being technical studies, they may not contain = the kind of information that you are looking for. >=20 > Another approach is to take the instrument in the context of being a = soloist in an ensemble. Depending upon the degree of precision you need, = determining the start of the onset can also be a problem, the sound of a = flute or trumpet for example having elements in common with determining = the start-time of a c-v syllable such as "too". >=20 > Can you provide a little more precision. >=20 > Thanks >=20 > Kevin >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > On 6/13/13, "Patel, Aniruddh D." <a.patel@xxxxxxxx> wrote: >> Dear list, >> =20 >> I=92m trying to find papers which report measurements of two aspects = of note duration in solo instrumental monophonic music (e.g., recordings = of solo violin, cello, trumpet, clarinet, flute, etc. =96 not piano, = guitar, or other instruments that can play multiple notes = simultaneously). >> =20 >> 1. The average duration of notes in a piece >> 2. A histogram of note durations in the piece >> =20 >> Thus for example this solo cello prelude by JS Bach last about 4 = minutes and contains N notes (anybody know?), so the average note = duration in this piece is about N/240 notes/sec. =20 >> =20 >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DdtLKjeEssAo >> =20 >> If one could measure the duration of each note in this recording, = then one could plot the histogram of note durations in the piece. >> =20 >> Is anyone aware of such data for any solo monophonic instrument? = Musical style doesn=92t matter (can be classical, folk, etc.). =20 >>=20 >> Thanks, >> =20 >> Ani Patel >> =20 >> =20 >> Aniruddh D. Patel >> Associate Professor >> Dept. of Psychology >> Tufts University >> 490 Boston Ave. >> Medford, MA 02115 >> =20 >> a.patel@xxxxxxxx >> http://ase.tufts.edu/psychology/peoplePatel.htm >> =20 >> =20 >> =20 >> =20