Subject: Re: AUDITORY Digest - 9 Aug 2012 to 10 Aug 2012 (#2012-195) From: Ken Grant <ken.w.grant@xxxxxxxx> Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2012 00:32:20 -0400 List-Archive:<http://lists.mcgill.ca/scripts/wa.exe?LIST=AUDITORY>Has anyone noticed that the amount of space dedicated to this topic so far Has dwarfed the original request for an article? We all have the ability to ignore posts and hit delete whenever the mood inspires. So long as there are no copyright laws broken does it really matter at all whether members ask other members for help them find articles? Sent from my iPhone On Aug 11, 2012, at 12:01 AM, AUDITORY automatic digest system <LISTSERV@xxxxxxxx> wrote: > There are 2 messages totalling 246 lines in this issue. > > Topics of the day: > > 1. exploitation of "Auditory List" as a free "Article Request" list (2) > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2012 07:31:25 +0100 > From: =?utf-8?Q?Jos=C3=A9_Ignacio_Alc=C3=A1ntara?= <jia10@xxxxxxxx> > Subject: Re: exploitation of "Auditory List" as a free "Article Request" list > > Thank you Al for making a point that appears to have been overlooked and is h= > ighly pertinent to the matter at hand. I might also add that the journal-acc= > ess problem is also sometimes an issue for researchers in universities that m= > ight appear to be well funded - this is often not actually the case in pract= > ice: University Departments run on budgets that are increasingly diminishing= > and Library funding is often a target for cutbacks. There are several journ= > als of interest to me that we do not have a current subscription for, mostly= > because to get access to one journal necessitates subscribing to a group of= > journals, many of which are not of interest to our readers. (This is a larg= > er issue that I will not go into, though one that will be familiar to many o= > n this list.) > > I have always taken the view that anyone who requests a paper from members o= > n the list will first have attempted to access it by whatever (legitimate) c= > hannels are available to them; failing those, they email the list for assist= > ance. Personally, I have no problem with this use of the list - I have both r= > equested and provided articles when the need arises. Furthermore, I consider= > it perfectly reasonable that a community of like-minded researchers should a= > ssist one another in the spirit of not impeding research, which we may all b= > enefit from in the future.=20 > > Yours, > > Jos=C3=A9 Ignacio Alc=C3=A1ntara=20 > > Sent from my iPhone > > On 6 Aug 2012, at 22:42, Al Bregman <al.bregman@xxxxxxxx> wrote: > >> Hi all, >> =20 >> Regarding the requests for articles, I would like to remind everyone >> that many members of this list live in countries where the >> universities and libraries are grossly underfunded and therefore can't >> subscribe to many journals, and may not have an inter-library loan >> system in place. Any articles that we can send them (directly rather >> than via the list) will help these list members to develop arts, >> science, and technology in their countries. (Another reason why >> blanket rules can result in unwanted consequences). >> =20 >> Cheers, >> Al >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------= > --- >> Albert S. Bregman, Emeritus Professor >> Psychology Department, McGill University >> 1205 Doctor Penfield Avenue >> Montreal, QC, Canada H3A 1B1. >> Office: Phone: (514) three-nine-eight-6103, >> Fax: (514) three-nine-eight-4896 >> http://webpages.mcgill.ca/staff/Group2/abregm1/web/ >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------= > --- >> =20 >> =20 >> On Mon, Aug 6, 2012 at 1:48 PM, David Morris <dmorris@xxxxxxxx> wrote: >>> Having recently posted the on the list requesting an article (a golden ol= > die from more than half a century ago, that no library in my vicinity could p= > roduce) one can't help but feel vilified by Brian's mail. I'm sure that was= > n't his intention, and us article-hustlers should take it in the reasonable h= > ouse-keeping spirit with which it was probably intended. >>> =20 >>> On the other hand, seven member of the list subsequently wrote to me off l= > ist and requested a copy. Perhaps we should all adjust our mail filters to r= > eflect our interests and avoid an exchange like the one we had over Position= > s Vacant postings - unproductive and unresolved. >>> =20 >>> David Morris > > ------------------------------ > > Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2012 02:22:31 -0700 > From: Marcelo Caetano <gaiolouvo-auditory@xxxxxxxx> > Subject: Re: exploitation of "Auditory List" as a free "Article Request" list > > --972819098-1168942497-1344590551=:60633 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > Dear list,=0A=A0=0AI agree that the list works very well without this kind = > of explicit rules. I only suggested to discuss rules instead of imposing th= > em. I felt that the original message did not necessarily reflect the opinio= > n of the majority about the issue and thought it would be very positive to = > hear the opinion of others.=0A=A0=0AI am very pleased to see that many memb= > ers have=A0engaged in=A0a lively and productive discussion, including the f= > ounder of the auditory list (Al), along with the current maintainer (Dan). = > Somebody wrote that this discussion was going nowhere, just like the one ab= > out job announcements. I disagree. Now we know how the people who expressed= > themselves feel about=A0both issues and, above all, the opinion of the maj= > ority predominated.=0A=A0=0ABest,=0AMarcelo=0A=0A=0A>______________________= > __________=0A> De: Jos=E9 Ignacio Alc=E1ntara <jia10@xxxxxxxx>=0A>Para: AU= > DITORY@xxxxxxxx =0A>Enviadas: Sexta-feira, 10 de Agosto de 2012 9:31= > =0A>Assunto: Re: [AUDITORY] exploitation of "Auditory List" as a free "Arti= > cle Request" list=0A> =0A>Thank you Al for making a point that appears to = > have been overlooked and is highly pertinent to the matter at hand. I might= > also add that the journal-access problem is also sometimes an issue for re= > searchers in universities that might appear to be well funded - this is oft= > en not actually the case in practice: University Departments run on budgets= > that are increasingly diminishing and Library funding is often a target fo= > r cutbacks. There are several journals of interest to me that we do not hav= > e a current subscription for, mostly because to get access to one journal n= > ecessitates subscribing to a group of journals, many of which are not of in= > terest to our readers. (This is a larger issue that I will not go into, tho= > ugh one that will be familiar to many on this list.)=0A>=0A>I have always t= > aken the view that anyone who requests a paper from members on the list wil= > l first have attempted to access it by whatever (legitimate) channels are a= > vailable to them; failing those, they email the list for assistance. Person= > ally, I have no problem with this use of the list - I have both requested a= > nd provided articles when the need arises. Furthermore, I consider it perfe= > ctly reasonable that a community of like-minded researchers should assist o= > ne another in the spirit of not impeding research, which we may all benefit= > from in the future. =0A>=0A>Yours,=0A>=0A>Jos=E9 Ignacio Alc=E1ntara =0A>= > =0A>Sent from my iPhone=0A>=0A>On 6 Aug 2012, at 22:42, Al Bregman <al.breg= > man@xxxxxxxx> wrote:=0A>=0A>> Hi all,=0A>> =0A>> Regarding the requests fo= > r articles, I would like to remind everyone=0A>> that many members of this = > list live in countries where the=0A>> universities and libraries are grossl= > y underfunded and therefore can't=0A>> subscribe to many journals, and may = > not have an inter-library loan=0A>> system in place.=A0 Any articles that w= > e can send them (directly rather=0A>> than via the list) will help these li= > st members to develop arts,=0A>> science, and technology in their countries= > .=A0 (Another reason why=0A>> blanket rules can result in unwanted conseque= > nces).=0A>> =0A>> Cheers,=0A>> Al=0A>> ------------------------------------= > -----------------------------------------=0A>> Albert S. Bregman, Emeritus = > Professor=0A>> Psychology Department, McGill University=0A>> 1205 Doctor Pe= > nfield Avenue=0A>> Montreal, QC, Canada H3A 1B1.=0A>> Office:=A0 Phone: (51= > 4) three-nine-eight-6103,=0A>>=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Fax: (514) three-nine= > -eight-4896=0A>> http://webpages.mcgill.ca/staff/Group2/abregm1/web/=0A>> -= > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------= > -=0A>> =0A>> =0A>> On Mon, Aug 6, 2012 at 1:48 PM, David Morris <dmorris@xxxxxxxx= > m.ku.dk> wrote:=0A>>> Having recently posted the on the list requesting an = > article (a golden oldie from more than half a century ago, that no library = > in my vicinity could produce) one can't help but feel vilified by Brian's m= > ail.=A0 I'm sure that wasn't his intention, and us article-hustlers should = > take it in the reasonable house-keeping spirit with which it was probably i= > ntended.=0A>>> =0A>>> On the other hand, seven member of the list subsequen= > tly wrote to me off list and requested a copy.=A0 Perhaps we should all adj= > ust our mail filters to reflect our interests and avoid an exchange like th= > e one we had over Positions Vacant postings - unproductive and unresolved.= > =0A>>> =0A>>> David Morris=0A>=0A>=0A> > --972819098-1168942497-1344590551=:60633 > Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > <html><body><div style=3D"color:; background-color:; font-family:times new = > roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt"><div><span>Dear list,</span><= > /div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: times new roman, new y= > ork, times, serif; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; background-color: t= > ransparent;"><span></span> </div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); fo= > nt-family: times new roman, new york, times, serif; font-size: 16px; font-s= > tyle: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span>I agree that the list w= > orks very well without this kind of explicit rules. I only suggested to dis= > cuss rules instead of imposing them. I felt that the original message did n= > ot necessarily reflect the opinion of the majority about the issue and thou= > ght it would be very positive to hear the opinion of others.</span></div><d= > iv style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: times new roman, new york, ti= > mes, serif; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; background-color: > transparent;"><span></span> </div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = > font-family: times new roman, new york, times, serif; font-size: 16px; font= > -style: normal; background-color: transparent;"><span></span><span>I am ver= > y pleased to see that many members have engaged in a lively and p= > roductive discussion, including the founder of the auditory list (Al), alon= > g with the current maintainer (Dan). </span>Somebody wrote that this discus= > sion was going nowhere, just like the one about job announcements. I disagr= > ee. Now we know how the people who expressed themselves feel about bot= > h issues and, above all, the opinion of the majority predominated.</div><di= > v> </div><div>Best,</div><div>Marcelo<br></div><blockquote style=3D"pa= > dding-left: 5px; margin-top: 5px; margin-left: 5px; border-left-color: rgb(= > 16, 16, 255); border-left-width: 2px; border-left-style: solid;"> <div sty= > le=3D"font-family: times new roman, new york, times, serif; font-size: > 12pt;"> <div style=3D"font-family: times new roman, new york, times, serif= > ; font-size: 12pt;"> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <font size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"> <di= > v style=3D"margin: 5px 0px; padding: 0px; border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 2= > 04); height: 0px; line-height: 0; font-size: 0px;" class=3D"hr" contentEdit= > able=3D"false" readonly=3D"true"></div> <b><span style=3D"font-weight: bol= > d;">De:</span></b> Jos=E9 Ignacio Alc=E1ntara <jia10@xxxxxxxx><br> <= > b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">Para:</span></b> AUDITORY@xxxxxxxx= > .CA <br> <b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">Enviadas:</span></b> Sexta-f= > eira, 10 de Agosto de 2012 9:31<br> <b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold;">A= > ssunto:</span></b> Re: [AUDITORY] exploitation of "Auditory List" as a free= > "Article Request" list<br> </font> </div> <br>Thank you Al for making a po= > int that appears to have been overlooked and is highly pertinent to the mat= > ter at hand. I might also add that the journal-access problem is also somet= > imes an issue for > researchers in universities that might appear to be well funded - this is = > often not actually the case in practice: University Departments run on budg= > ets that are increasingly diminishing and Library funding is often a target= > for cutbacks. There are several journals of interest to me that we do not = > have a current subscription for, mostly because to get access to one journa= > l necessitates subscribing to a group of journals, many of which are not of= > interest to our readers. (This is a larger issue that I will not go into, = > though one that will be familiar to many on this list.)<br><br>I have alway= > s taken the view that anyone who requests a paper from members on the list = > will first have attempted to access it by whatever (legitimate) channels ar= > e available to them; failing those, they email the list for assistance. Per= > sonally, I have no problem with this use of the list - I have both requeste= > d and provided articles when the need arises. Furthermore, I > consider it perfectly reasonable that a community of like-minded researche= > rs should assist one another in the spirit of not impeding research, which = > we may all benefit from in the future. <br><br>Yours,<br><br>Jos=E9 Ignacio= > Alc=E1ntara <br><br>Sent from my iPhone<br><br>On 6 Aug 2012, at 22:42, Al= > Bregman <<a href=3D"mailto:al.bregman@xxxxxxxx" ymailto=3D"mailto:al.b= > regman@xxxxxxxx">al.bregman@xxxxxxxx</a>> wrote:<br><br>> Hi all,<b= > r>> <br>> Regarding the requests for articles, I would like to remind= > everyone<br>> that many members of this list live in countries where th= > e<br>> universities and libraries are grossly underfunded and therefore = > can't<br>> subscribe to many journals, and may not have an inter-library= > loan<br>> system in place. Any articles that we can send them (di= > rectly rather<br>> than via the list) will help these list members to de= > velop arts,<br>> science, and technology in their countries. > (Another reason why<br>> blanket rules can result in unwanted consequen= > ces).<br>> <br>> Cheers,<br>> Al<br>> -------------------------= > ----------------------------------------------------<br>> Albert S. Breg= > man, Emeritus Professor<br>> Psychology Department, McGill University<br= >> > 1205 Doctor Penfield Avenue<br>> Montreal, QC, Canada H3A 1B1.<br>= > > Office: Phone: (514) three-nine-eight-6103,<br>> = > Fax: (514) three-nine-eight-4896<br>> <a hr= > ef=3D"http://webpages.mcgill.ca/staff/Group2/abregm1/web/" target=3D"_blank= > ">http://webpages.mcgill.ca/staff/Group2/abregm1/web/</a><br>> ---------= > --------------------------------------------------------------------<br>>= > ; <br>> <br>> On Mon, Aug 6, 2012 at 1:48 PM, David Morris <<a hre= > f=3D"mailto:dmorris@xxxxxxxx" ymailto=3D"mailto:dmorris@xxxxxxxx">dmorris= > @xxxxxxxx</a>> wrote:<br>>> Having recently posted the on the lis= > t > requesting an article (a golden oldie from more than half a century ago, t= > hat no library in my vicinity could produce) one can't help but feel vilifi= > ed by Brian's mail. I'm sure that wasn't his intention, and us articl= > e-hustlers should take it in the reasonable house-keeping spirit with which= > it was probably intended.<br>>> <br>>> On the other hand, seve= > n member of the list subsequently wrote to me off list and requested a copy= > . Perhaps we should all adjust our mail filters to reflect our intere= > sts and avoid an exchange like the one we had over Positions Vacant posting= > s - unproductive and unresolved.<br>>> <br>>> David Morris<br><= > br><br> </div> </div> </blockquote> </div></body></html> > --972819098-1168942497-1344590551=:60633-- > > ------------------------------ > > End of AUDITORY Digest - 9 Aug 2012 to 10 Aug 2012 (#2012-195) > **************************************************************